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11-02-2015, 02:29 AM
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#1
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,850
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Lee vs Brawn
Yall we're arguing with me a few years back, saying size won't do much for you if the other person knows how to fight. Well... of course I'd agree that knowing how to fight can be the difference between life or death. But then again, there's a reason fighters have weight classes.
http://thechive.com/2015/11/02/the-m...cgregor-video/
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11-02-2015, 07:00 PM
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#2
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I, Vettezuki
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 14,754
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Didn't one of the Gracies routinely beat people way bigger than him in early UFC?
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11-03-2015, 10:57 AM
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#3
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pain's fun, hit me again
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vettezuki
Didn't one of the Gracies routinely beat people way bigger than him in early UFC?
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That was a long time ago when the UFC "rules" were more like guidlines and he would essentially force all of his opponents into a jon striking grappling match.
I'm not really sure what I just watched. I saw two friends fucking around ar sparring practice. That is hardly sparring. Two trained fighters, not even needing to be equal, the fighter who has beem at his weight the longest will generally have the biggest advantage. The mountain is slow and not a striker and that pretty obvious since he was really grabby even when the were playing. He also does the cardinal sin for guys that size to leave themselves "an in" since they can't cover distance like a smaller person. He extends his lead leg and locks it out, great for giving someone large with low speed the ability to creat a large perimeter that's difficult for small people tonget in. Great for ring or points sparring. But. Leave that thing locked out anywhere else and someone smart will break it, immediately. Number 1 rules to a fair fight, don't fight fair.
Never box a boxer
Never grapple a grappler
Don't fight a Cage fighter with rules
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Forget about winning and losing; forget about pride and pain. Let your opponent graze your skin and you smash into his flesh; let him smash into your flesh and you fracture his bones; let him fracture your bones and you take his life. Do not be concerned with escaping safely — lay your life before him
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11-03-2015, 11:27 AM
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#4
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I, Vettezuki
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 14,754
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One of my favorite scenes from FF7 is when Vin Diesel tries to ram Jason Stathems character, then gets all butt hurt because his car was reinforced. He said something like, "you thought this was going to be a fair fight. That's your mistake."
And finally, "never bet against another man's game."
Ancient wisdom.
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11-03-2015, 12:55 PM
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#5
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pain's fun, hit me again
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,264
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Yep, plenty of guys like me that can take shots all day to the face with a smile, but don't fair so well to fingers in the eye, or having an ear or thumb ripped off.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Forget about winning and losing; forget about pride and pain. Let your opponent graze your skin and you smash into his flesh; let him smash into your flesh and you fracture his bones; let him fracture your bones and you take his life. Do not be concerned with escaping safely — lay your life before him
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11-05-2015, 07:17 AM
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#6
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,850
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vettezuki
Didn't one of the Gracies routinely beat people way bigger than him in early UFC?
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And that's notable to you why? Because subconsciously you know it's atypical? 
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11-05-2015, 11:40 AM
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#7
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I, Vettezuki
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 14,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enkeivette
And that's notable to you why? Because subconsciously you know it's atypical? |
No. In a context where the rules are more open, a smaller but significantly more skilled fighter (KEY) can f up a bigger guy. In a constrained rule context except size, the bigger guy has an advantage on average, in a constrained rule and size context, the more skilled guy wins. It's game theory 101. Exactly the same stuff goes on in car racing where they are constantly adjusting rules to "make it competitive".
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11-05-2015, 01:25 PM
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#8
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pain's fun, hit me again
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vettezuki
No. In a context where the rules are more open, a smaller but significantly more skilled fighter (KEY) can f up a bigger guy. In a constrained rule context except size, the bigger guy has an advantage on average, in a constrained rule and size context, the more skilled guy wins. It's game theory 101. Exactly the same stuff goes on in car racing where they are constantly adjusting rules to "make it competitive".
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Exactly. He would lay on the ground and wait for as long as it took for someone to engage him because certain things can and can't be done. Try and pull that shit in the ring now a days and they make you stand up. Do it in the street and well, you can use your imagination.
__________________
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Forget about winning and losing; forget about pride and pain. Let your opponent graze your skin and you smash into his flesh; let him smash into your flesh and you fracture his bones; let him fracture your bones and you take his life. Do not be concerned with escaping safely — lay your life before him
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11-05-2015, 02:01 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 739
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enkeivette
Yall we're arguing with me a few years back, saying size won't do much for you if the other person knows how to fight. Well... of course I'd agree that knowing how to fight can be the difference between life or death. But then again, there's a reason fighters have weight classes.
http://thechive.com/2015/11/02/the-m...cgregor-video/ |
What exactly is the point you're trying to make? That skill doesn't matter if a guy is bigger and stronger? That size and strength will always trump skill? Not sure how that video makes whatever point you're trying to make. Please explain.
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HP numbers are good and all, but they are like asking someone how much they can bench. What difference does it make if I can still kick your ass?
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11-06-2015, 07:54 AM
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#10
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Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,850
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My point isn't that size trumps skill. My point is that size does matter. I was only defending against the statement that 'size doesn't matter if you know how to fight.'
I aver that beefcake Guy now at 200 lbs would kick Guy's twins ass at 160 lbs. It's hard for me to describe what I mean other than simply arguing that size does matter, at least usually, because it depends on context. Like, in the video, there's a smaller skilled fighter put up against a fictional WWF fighter. The smaller dude obviously is quicker, but skill or no skill, its harder for him to move a tree stump.
So my point isn't that size trumps skill or vice versa, my point is that EVERYTHING matters... we don't live in a box.
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