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Old 06-23-2011, 02:29 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Kozak View Post
Am I psychic or what?
Maybe not so psychic. Where there is value there are thieves. Like I said, the fact people are targeting the "currency" for crime only means it's actually useful.
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Old 06-23-2011, 03:11 PM   #22
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Ben,
Do you have any bitcoins and if so how exactly does one acquire and spend them exactly? Links please and remember I am retarded so dumb it down for me.
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Old 06-23-2011, 03:25 PM   #23
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Ben,
Do you have any bitcoins and if so how exactly does one acquire and spend them exactly? Links please and remember I am retarded so dumb it down for me.
I have a few. You can get bitcoins a few ways.

#1 You can get them for free (free = the cost of running your computer)

http://www.bitcoin.org/

Go there and download the bitcoin app and your computer will start mining.

#2 You can buy/trade them from an exchange service.

https://www.bitcoinmarket.com/
https://bitmarket.eu/
http://liliontransfer.org/ << A big exchange
http://www.mtgox.com/ << also A big exchange

Lots more are here
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Trade
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Old 06-23-2011, 03:47 PM   #24
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So, if I'm getting this right, you can basically mine free money? How does that equate to real dollar value?
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:20 PM   #25
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So, if I'm getting this right, you can basically mine free money? How does that equate to real dollar value?
Ultimately if you think of it in terms of dollar value, you're missing the point of the "money" and of why the government finds it dangerous.

Moreover, it ain't free if you have to spend hundreds of hours of CPU time to generate the coins. There's quite a lot that goes into a theory of money here of why BitCoin is an interesting idea. It has characteristics that make it unique in history. It is virtual, that is not backed like a traditional commodity money, but is an intensely and systematically constrained supply. So it meets a key criteria of scarcity, but not of inherent (original use based value).

My interests are that it is a systematically constrained money supply, that is immune to arbitrary increase in base money stock, and two, works on a peer to peer network which, unlike other attempts at creating competitive currencies, including digital currencies, is highly resistant to government attack because there is no central clearing house or physical entities to attack. (The government is a real monopoly that uses guns and cages to protect its racket.) This is quite a finger in the eye of the man and is a step in the direction of establishing resilient financial institutions for Agorists in particular.
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:24 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackax View Post
I have a few. You can get bitcoins a few ways.

#1 You can get them for free (free = the cost of running your computer)

http://www.bitcoin.org/

Go there and download the bitcoin app and your computer will start mining.

#2 You can buy/trade them from an exchange service.

https://www.bitcoinmarket.com/
https://bitmarket.eu/
http://liliontransfer.org/ << A big exchange
http://www.mtgox.com/ << also A big exchange

Lots more are here
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Trade

Correct. 2 is the point, particularly as direct use as money. 1 is only the mechanism of creating the supply in the first place.

There's an outside chance that if adopted and used more expansively, the relative value of BitCoin to USD could go sky high.
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:26 PM   #27
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Yeah if its free to get how will it ever hold a value?
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Old 06-23-2011, 07:55 PM   #28
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For those interested in understanding monetary theory at a deep level, why BitCoin is kinda unique, and why fiat currencies have the repeated problems they do, I suggest:

The Theory of Money and Credit

It's heavy, but look at just the index and follow a subject if it peeks your interest.
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Old 06-28-2011, 02:42 PM   #29
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I just wanna say to all the people with the "if it's free to make how does it hold value" mentality: Ask the federal reserve, they've been doing it since 19...seventy...something. Look at the back of your USD currency, that shit is legal tender, it holds no actual value.
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Old 06-28-2011, 04:18 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kozak View Post
I just wanna say to all the people with the "if it's free to make how does it hold value" mentality: Ask the federal reserve, they've been doing it since 19...seventy...something. Look at the back of your USD currency, that shit is legal tender, it holds no actual value.
What? The full faith and credit of the United States isn't good enough for you?

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." - Henry Ford

What people really don't understand is that CB Fiat money is a kind debt instrument. It is fundamentally different than a commodity money (i.e., real money). BitCoin is a unique case because it is Fiat but there is no central anything and there is no arbitrary human control of supply, so while not commodity backed itself, it resembles far more in common with a commodity backed money and total free banking than any major existing currency. Which is why governments hate it.
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